Coming Out

Peg Welch's stance on coming out when fighting for LGBTQ+ rights in York, PA.

York Area LAMBDA, started in the 1990s and originally known as York Support Inc., was an educational, political, and social group for the LGBTQ+ community of York, PA and the surrounding area.

Cathy Nelson was born in Brooklyn, New York, and moved to Staten Island, New York, at the age of two with her strict Italian-Swedish family. As a child, Cathy loved music and did well in school. She also participated in Catholic youth group retreats, where she first encountered anti-gay sentiment. Although she knew she was attracted to girls from an early age, Cathy did not act on these feelings until age 22, when she entered her first long-term relationship. Cathy worked as a teacher in Carlisle, PA, but stopped teaching after suffering a head injury that affected her speech. Currently, she does secretarial work for a friend and ally at Goldcrafter’s Corner. Cathy was involved with the Pride planning committee and sang with the Central Pennsylvania Women’s Chorus. In this interview, Cathy discusses the process of coming out to herself, her family, and her friends. She also describes the Harrisburg-area lesbian community in the early 1990s and the problems and successes of the Women’s Chorus throughout her years of involvement. Cathy also discusses the general acceptance of lesbians in mainstream culture, but condemns the exclusion of transgender issues from the LGBT community and the transphobia that she sees as a major issue of the day.

Eva O’Diam was born in Dayton, Ohio in 1953 to her mother, a school teacher, and her father, an engineer. Growing up in conservative, rural Ohio, Eva lost her father at the age of 12 and moved to Covington, Ohio where she graduated from high school. At Manchester College, where she earned a degree in sociology, Eva was interested in ministry but grew disillusioned with the church during her last year of college and became a probation officer in Wabash, Indiana. About 18 months later, a Church of the Brethren pastor influenced Eva to return to the ministry, and she has since worked at various positions in pastoring, alternative ministry, and HIV/AIDS assistance. She currently lives in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania with her partner of 23 years, Mary Kelly, and is looking for work as a pastor again. In this interview, Eva discusses her slow personal journey to accept her sexual orientation, the challenge to make her Metropolitan Community Church [MCC] more inclusive of racial, sexual, and ability minorities, as well as her nephew’s unfortunate death that united her family and church community. Regarding LGBT issues, Eva is optimistic for the future but admits that the LGBT community needs to adopt a broader focus, be more inclusive, and address growing challenges for older adults.

Louie Marven moved to central Pennsylvania from his hometown of Wappingers Falls, New York to attend Messiah College in 2003 and has lived in the Harrisburg area ever since. The school’s conservative values and prohibition of “homosexual behavior” made Louie’s time there complicated, and it wasn’t until after he graduated that he came out. He then began working for the LGBT Center, taking on the role of Youth Director and Administrator when the Center merged with Common Roads, and then accepting the position of Executive Director in 2012. In this interview, Louie discusses his experience of being gay at an evangelical Christian college, recalling experiences both as a student and as an alumnus that have caused him to think critically about the specific issues of LGBT inclusion that arise from the environment of the school. He also talks about the issues that he finds most pressing for the LGBT community at the moment, what being out means in terms of his life today, and his hopes for the community’s future.

The interview performed on March 23, 2015 is with Oral History project volunteer, Michele Metcalf and long-time LGBT activist and self-identified gay man, Phil Wenger. Wenger was born and raised in Ethiopia in a large Mennonite missionary family and returned to his family’s roots in Central Pennsylvania when he was 12. In this interview, he speaks about his coming out, his advocacy with Pride and the Harrisburg LGBT Center, and with the Lancaster AIDS Project. He goes on to speak about how all of these factors have affected his life, life path, and relationships.

Lindsay Snowden was born in Pittsburgh on March 15, 1976. Lindsay worked a bunch of odd jobs and has had an entrepreneurial spirit since a young age. Lindsay joined the military when sirb was 17. Lindsay realized after moving to Harrisburg that sirb would not be welcome in the military due to sirb’s sexuality. Coming out to sirb’s family was easy because sirb grew up with gay family members. Lindsay has worked on my projects in the area like forming the first all black drag king troupe in Central Pennsylvania, House of Game; publishing a magazine called Studs Magazine; and running a female football team. Lindsay talks about sirb’s experience with sirb’s drag troupe and how difficult it is to get booked as an all black group in Central Pennsylvania. Lindsay talks about sirb’s evolving gender identity, the intersections of sirb’s identity, and the importance of family.

Maria Warren grew up in Baltimore, Maryland, in a religious family with both her blood-related and adopted siblings. Maria was very involved in her mother’s church, attending Sunday services, Bible study, and choir rehearsal, but realized that she was gay around age 12. In order to escape her feelings, Maria immersed herself in religion and married her boyfriend after graduating from high school, but her marriage was fraught with tension and ended in divorce. In this interview, Maria discusses the issues in her previous marriage, her relationships with her three children, and the importance PFLAG [formerly stood for Parents, Families and Friends of Lesbians and Gays] played in her coming out process. She also describes her experience of couples counseling with her ex-husband, who eventually outed Maria’s sexuality to most of her family, and the LGBT community in Baltimore that she relied on when the two separated. Today, Maria is living her self-described “dream” life with her partner in York, Pennsylvania, and hopes that by participating in the LGBT History Project, she can help prevent other LGBT individuals from experiencing the same difficult coming out process that she did.

Teresa “Teddy” Maurer was born in Lykens, Pennsylvania. Following a move to Upper Dauphin County, she grew up and graduated from Halifax High School. From there she worked at the Nedrich shirt factory for a few years before moving onto a job with the state government. She eventually moved to Harrisburg and stayed there after she retired from her job at the state. She worked for the government for 37 years. She discusses her conflict with derogatory comments and other discrimination she saw in her workplace and in the greater LGBT community around her. She explains how her mother’s death at the hands of a drunk driver when she was 25 and how when a former girlfriend forced her to come out changed her life. She now works with the LGBT center to give back for the times when she could not.

Michelle Probulus, 43, describes her experience with realizing that she is a lesbian at age 40, while married to a man with whom she had two young sons. She discusses the complications of figuring out her sexuality and coming to the realization she was a lesbian and the subsequent difficulty of coming out to her husband, her children, her family, and her friends. After getting a divorce, she began getting involved in Lancaster’s LGBT community, and she describes her experiences in meeting people and working for greater LGBT acceptance, including starting her own oral history project to collect some of the experiences of women who realized they were lesbians later in life. She discusses how coming out has affected the way she raises her sons as well as her career choices, specifically her new sense of purpose as a guidance counselor in being an advocate and a support system for young people coming out.

Prior to coming out at the age of 32, Ted Martin had worked for many years for the government and public policy organizations, chiefly in the areas of communications and advocacy. Martin lived in Washington, D.C. and worked for Congress before returning to Pennsylvania, where he worked at the Historic Harrisburg Association and then his alma mater Dickinson College, at which point he came out. He became involved with the Team Pennsylvania Foundation and became part of the Rendell administration, serving in the Department of Community and Economic Development and as an advisor on LGBT issues. He currently works as the Executive Director of Equality Pennsylvania, the PA LGBT advocacy organization. In this interview, he discusses his life prior to, during, and since coming out, as well as the ways in which being out and gay has affected his life and his work.

For the very first interview of the history project, Edmund Good and Thurman Grossnickle describe their coming out stories. Thurman is a retired Scientist Administrator and has spent many years in academia and in health professions, as well as in LGBT organizations. He considers himself Brethren, although he no longer attends church, though a large part of his coming out process involved the organization, Dignity, which was primarily run by the late Father Saude (ph.). Upon discovering his sexuality, Thurman spent a considerable amount of his time dedicated to the LGBT community of Harrisburg, operating the Gay and Lesbian Switchboard, attending and hosting Dignity events, and serving as editor of the Dignity newsletter. Thurman discusses his involvement, his experiences living in Central PA, and his decision to never divorce his wife. Edmund is a retired apartment manager, though he is still involved in the Brethren Housing organization, which finds places for mothers going from welfare to work. Edmund explains that though he was always kind of aware of his sexuality, he hadn’t really come out before attending college. At Penn State, he was involved in several LGBT outlets, including the student organization HOPS (Homosexuals of Penn State), which was supported and funded by Penn State. Edmund, too, alludes to the friendly climate, which he’s experienced during his life as a gay man in Central PA. In the second half of their interview, Ed and Thurman tackle some deeper issues. Ed discusses how his work and family life didn’t change too much overall, but there were some bumps. At first, his parents didn’t understand what it meant to be gay, creating an estrangement. But with the introduction of Thurman into the picture, they had a change of heart. Ed and Thurman discuss other difficulties they’ve endured in 33 years as a couple. Despite being made coal on the carpet, a church backed them up and defied their national organization, making it a known safe space for LGBT couples. On a less happy note, they discuss a community’s reaction to Thurman’s friendship with a gay teenage boy. As Ed and Thurman reflect on the past events they’ve encountered, they note where we’ve come from and where we still need to go. Ed mentions several websites, webinars, and workshops that helped him as a gay man, but could also help others to understand and love thy neighbor.

Delma Welch was born in Washington D.C. and grew up in Cardiff, Maryland as a Catholic with her three brothers and one sister. Delma began going to NOW [National Organization for Women] meetings in 1975 after becoming interested in feminism from an early age. After being in a relationship with a man for 23 years, she met her future wife at the YWCA and ended her marriage. Originally a stay at home mother, Delma has since held several jobs throughout her life, including her current position at the Margaret Moul Home. Today, she lives in York, Pennsylvania with her partner of 25 years, Peg Welch. In this interview, Delma discusses her involvement in many civil rights organizations and marches starting in the 70s, issues with coming out to her family, and marriage to Peg—once in Canada and once more in Pennsylvania, when gay marriage became legalized in the state. She also briefly expresses the importance of lesbian and woman-only spaces and her positive experiences dealing with the legal system as a lesbian woman in a same-sex relationship.

Barry Loveland interviews Alex Reber, now 32, who relates fascinating stories of what it was like growing up as an only child of an Evangelical Christian family raised on a farm in Bethel, a rural town between Harrisburg and Allentown and becoming an important political LGBT activist in Central PA. His accounts at camp and high school reveal the difficulty of being gay and the interesting paths towards his independence. In Lebanon Valley College he was outed and blackballed at church, being called evil and having parents refuse to help him pay tuition. A gay couple started a foundation to help gay students complete college and Alex, a gifted child who received a scholarship, graduated a semester early. His tales about finding and working with a thriving gay community in Harrisburg are enthralling. He got an internship and became friends with Dan Miller, a leader in the gay community, in Dan’s accounting firm, Miller, Dixon, Drake. He tells in detail his work over ten years with Planned Parenthood, beginning with his own experience of being treated and shamed by a physician. He discusses his romance and marriage to his husband during the exciting time when marriage became legal in Pennsylvania. It was a momentous time. He explains what it was like attending the Equality March, primaries for Obama and Clinton, and his experience at the 2016 Democratic Convention. He recounts the inside stories of the contradictions and fun of local state politics— and stories about running candidates for state office and working on committees for the Democratic Party of Pennsylvania. He is very involved at the Center, FAB, and getting LGBT people to run for office.

Mary Nancarrow grew up in a suburb of Harrisburg, Pennsylvania in the 1950s and 1960s with divorced parents and two siblings. After graduating from Shippensburg University, she became prominent in the women’s movement and the LGBT movement in Central Pennsylvania, serving on the Governor’s Council for Sexual Minorities and the Rural Gay Caucus. Mary was also heavily involved in the National Organization for Women [NOW] and was elected NOW Pennsylvania President, working to pass marital rape legislation, funding and campaigning for political races, and fundraising money for the NOW PAC. After her presidency, she helped to plan the National March for LGBT Rights in Washington D.C. and volunteered for the Harrisburg Gay and Lesbian Switchboard. Today, Mary lives in Harrisburg and sings in the Women’s Chorus. In this interview, Mary discusses her childhood and early relationship to religion as well as her involvement with the anti-Vietnam War movement throughout high school and college. She also describes her contributions to Shippensburg Gays United, feminism within the gay rights movement, and the experience of coming out to her parents and friends. Mary concludes the interview by acknowledging the incredible extent to which the LGBT community has changed over her lifetime and expresses her hope to see ongoing growth in civil rights in the future.

Walter Heiliger was born in 1944 and grew up in rural Carroll County, Maryland, the second of three children. Walter, who describes himself as “severely hearing-impaired,” encountered difficulties in school and in connecting with others growing up, as he did not receive support for his hearing issues. Over the course of his career, Walter worked in a number of different positions at a variety of companies, including Head Ski Company and Black and Decker in Maryland and York Technical Institute and Freezing Equipment Sales in Pennsylvania. Now retired, he currently works part-time as a custodian at South York School District. Although he was aware that he was interested in men early on and had several relationships with men, he decided to marry a woman in an attempt to live a “normal” life. While the marriage was unfulfilling on many levels, Walter credits his wife for greatly improving his quality of life by getting him hearing aids and speech therapy, and it was through that marriage that Walter was able to have his three children. Walter came out in 1999, then in his mid-50s, and describes the varying levels of support he’s received from his family. Since coming out, he has slowly become more vocal in the LGBT community, joining PFLAG in Mechanicsburg for a time, attending programs for seniors through the LGBT Center, and working part-time at Altland’s Ranch in York. In this interview, Walter shares stories from his life, including his relationship with Bill, his most serious partner since coming out, who passed away in 2006. He also discusses the importance of reaching out to seniors in the LGBT community, as well as married men, and the idea of LGBT rights as a human rights issue rather than a political one.

Growing up in the conservative Lebanon County of central PA, Barbara Darkes attended grade school through the beginning of her pre-law college career without experiencing any attraction to women. It was at her summer job at the local YMCA during college that Barbara met and eventually fell in love with her long-term partner, Kathy. This same-sex relationship was the first for both of them, for neither woman had previously identified as a lesbian. Due to the conservative environment of central PA, the two women kept their relationship secret for years, which proved emotionally exhausting for both of them. Fortunately for Barbara, her work environment at McNees Wallace & Nurick, LLC, proved to be accepting and embracing of her intimacy with Kathy, and it became the site of the beginning of their coming out experiences in 2012. Although Barbara and Kathy encountered some painful disapproval during their coming out process, they also found spaces of acceptance that embraced them. The two married privately in Maryland in 2013, and they continue to have a healthy and loving relationship with each other and with Kathy’s kids. Barbara uses her position as a community organizer and as president of the LGBT Center to work towards generating a more accepting environment for LGBT people in the larger central Pennsylvania community.

Joanne Carroll was born in Alberta, Canada in 1940 as John Carroll. She spent the first 60 years of her life as a man, marrying twice and having two children. She worked a number of jobs throughout the country, primarily in the Air Force but also in hotel management and security. She transitioned in the 90s at around 60 years old, moved with her mother to Lancaster, and got heavily involved in trans advocacy throughout all of Pennsylvania as the president of TransCentral PA. In this interview, Joanne discusses a number of subjects relating to her experiences as a trans woman, including mental health, the transition process, and her experiences in coming out as trans to her family and friends. She also discusses issues of race, politics, white and male privilege, the current political climate (as of November 2016), and the importance of faith in her life.

Keystone is an educational and communication feature of Dignity/Central PA Inc. Noteworthy articles in this issue:

• "From the President" (p. 1)
• "Elections" (p. 1)
• "The Closet as Killer" (p. 5)

The Keystone newsletter was an educational and communication feature of Dignity/Central PA Inc. Noteworthy news in this issues:

• "From Your President: Don't Do This to Me!" (p. 1)
• "Reflections - Workshop on Assertiveness" (p. 2)
• "News Notes" (p. 3)

The Gay Era was a newspaper that reported news of interest from around the United States, with a specific focus on the news surrounding the gay community in Central PA, and provided a central forum for gay communities that were spread out across Central PA. Noteworthy news in this issues:

• "State-Wide Gay-Support Group Announced" (p. 2)
• "Council Appointments" (p. 4)
• "Rights Ordinance Introduced in State College" (p. 5)
• "Supreme Court Refuses to Hear Gay Case" (p. 6)
• "Anita's Source" (p. 11)
• "Rural Resources" (p. 15)

The Gay Era was a newspaper that reported news of interest from around the United States, with a specific focus on the news surrounding the gay community in Central PA, and provided a central forum for gay communities that were spread out across Central PA. Noteworthy news in this issues:

• "Allentwon Battle Continues: Gays Banned from City Forums" (p. 2)
• "Observations by David Leas" (p. 8)
• "Anita Display Removed in Misunderstanding" (p. 20)
• "Coming Out as an Old Man" (p. 24)

Keystone is an educational and communication feature of Dignity/Central PA Inc. Noteworthy articles in this issue:

• "Treasurer's Report" (p. 2)
• "Workshop"...Coming Out! (p. 5)
• "Notes from the President" (p. 5)
• "Appeal to Members" (p. 6)